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Correct coat on a working dog


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I'm old enough to remember good fell types, particulary those with a fair bit of Border in their make up, with ultra hard jackets and skin underneith like a fecking Rhino, don't see many like that these days :no:

 

;)

They are the sort of old :notworthy: propper borders had a very thick skin, and some were difficult to scruff, so thick was the skin!!!

But, I still hunt the hills every winter, where the border terrier was origionally bred, and with dogs that have far less protection from the weather... maybe an outcross is needed for my blood, to help restore coat.

 

Thats them D&N, ain't seen type like that for years. I'd be careful with that outcross if I were you, Borders with hard jackets & thick skin may be difficult to find but with excellent working ability, harder still...! ;)

Aye, tell us about it... like fookin rockin horse shit! But there are some good fell type strains in these parts that might suit my stuff... just a thought for now anyway. ;)

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coat means f**k all to a dog ,its born with it moults with it and grafts hard with it [im talking a true terrier] not some stripped out show thing thats never been dug too,held fast for 2 days soaking wet and no front nails pulling ever foward to do its job,YES they look tidy and show body form ,but whats the point in that [a f*****g ribbon.]

terriers years back earned their corn and without their jacket a lot would have got hypathermia on those long winters days and sometimes into the night......................steve

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most terriers that do proper work wont need striping out. and clipping on most dogs makes the coat tighter and harsher so more improved for working........ f*****g HATE show strips.

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id only ever hand strip my borders,they keep their coat all year, when you hunt them their coat comes out, clipping makes the coat come back soft, i think all this was bought about by the show fraternity, i can remember old fellas trying to get coats right on their tykes,by breeding rough to smooth, dont know if it worked, or if their are any old uns out their that could shed some light on that, the only time i strip my terrs is when they look to untidy for my eye.

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I strip mine short in the summer otherwise she sits about panting like f**k all day long but let it grow wild in the winter, shes got one hell of a thick coat and not once did i see her shiver one the coldest of mornings out last season

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I'm old enough to remember good fell types, particulary those with a fair bit of Border in their make up, with ultra hard jackets and skin underneith like a fecking Rhino, don't see many like that these days :no:

 

;)

They are the sort of old :notworthy: propper borders had a very thick skin, and some were difficult to scruff, so thick was the skin!!!

But, I still hunt the hills every winter, where the border terrier was origionally bred, and with dogs that have far less protection from the weather... maybe an outcross is needed for my blood, to help restore coat.

 

Thats them D&N, ain't seen type like that for years. I'd be careful with that outcross if I were you, Borders with hard jackets & thick skin may be difficult to find but with excellent working ability, harder still...! ;)

Aye, tell us about it... like fookin rockin horse shit! But there are some good fell type strains in these parts that might suit my stuff... just a thought for now anyway. ;)

Thanks lads I appreciate your thoughts regarding correct coat :clapper: I hope you dont mind me playing devils advocate

What is wrong with the Border Terrier, what has changed so much about the Border that it is nolonger valued as a worker today? wasnt the breed standard, which also includes temperment written by men who worked there dogs and new what they wanted in a border? granted they are not as hard as alot of other terriers.

It states hunting with terriers legally..The terriers role is to locate and flush the animal not to fight with it .

 

Only soft terriers which stand back and bark are to be used.

 

All reasonable steps must be taken to prevent risk or injury to your dog.

 

So why wouldnt the Border meet this legal criteria, I am not after anyone going on the defensive just there own honest opinion and thoughts, Have the times changed in what is now required from a working terrier of today.

Cheers

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I'm old enough to remember good fell types, particulary those with a fair bit of Border in their make up, with ultra hard jackets and skin underneith like a fecking Rhino, don't see many like that these days :no:

 

;)

They are the sort of old :notworthy: propper borders had a very thick skin, and some were difficult to scruff, so thick was the skin!!!

But, I still hunt the hills every winter, where the border terrier was origionally bred, and with dogs that have far less protection from the weather... maybe an outcross is needed for my blood, to help restore coat.

 

Thats them D&N, ain't seen type like that for years. I'd be careful with that outcross if I were you, Borders with hard jackets & thick skin may be difficult to find but with excellent working ability, harder still...! ;)

Aye, tell us about it... like fookin rockin horse shit! But there are some good fell type strains in these parts that might suit my stuff... just a thought for now anyway. ;)

Thanks lads I appreciate your thoughts regarding correct coat :clapper: I hope you dont mind me playing devils advocate

What is wrong with the Border Terrier, what has changed so much about the Border that it is nolonger valued as a worker today? wasnt the breed standard, which also includes temperment written by men who worked there dogs and new what they wanted in a border? granted they are not as hard as alot of other terriers.

It states hunting with terriers legally..The terriers role is to locate and flush the animal not to fight with it .

 

Only soft terriers which stand back and bark are to be used.

 

All reasonable steps must be taken to prevent risk or injury to your dog.

 

So why wouldnt the Border meet this legal criteria, I am not after anyone going on the defensive just there own honest opinion and thoughts, Have the times changed in what is now required from a working terrier of today.

Cheers

Dont get me wrong there are still a few who still see the border as such... a working terrier, with no daft money value attached...

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I'm old enough to remember good fell types, particulary those with a fair bit of Border in their make up, with ultra hard jackets and skin underneith like a fecking Rhino, don't see many like that these days :no:

 

;)

They are the sort of old :notworthy: propper borders had a very thick skin, and some were difficult to scruff, so thick was the skin!!!

But, I still hunt the hills every winter, where the border terrier was origionally bred, and with dogs that have far less protection from the weather... maybe an outcross is needed for my blood, to help restore coat.

 

Thats them D&N, ain't seen type like that for years. I'd be careful with that outcross if I were you, Borders with hard jackets & thick skin may be difficult to find but with excellent working ability, harder still...! ;)

Aye, tell us about it... like fookin rockin horse shit! But there are some good fell type strains in these parts that might suit my stuff... just a thought for now anyway. ;)

Thanks lads I appreciate your thoughts regarding correct coat :clapper: I hope you dont mind me playing devils advocate

What is wrong with the Border Terrier, what has changed so much about the Border that it is nolonger valued as a worker today? wasnt the breed standard, which also includes temperment written by men who worked there dogs and new what they wanted in a border? granted they are not as hard as alot of other terriers.

It states hunting with terriers legally..The terriers role is to locate and flush the animal not to fight with it .

 

Only soft terriers which stand back and bark are to be used.

 

All reasonable steps must be taken to prevent risk or injury to your dog.

 

So why wouldnt the Border meet this legal criteria, I am not after anyone going on the defensive just there own honest opinion and thoughts, Have the times changed in what is now required from a working terrier of today.

Cheers

Dont get me wrong there are still a few who still see the border as such... a working terrier, with no daft money value attached...

i think what happened to the border is fashion, someone sets a trend and the rest follow,so we end up with other ters, being bred by big names and the old fellas who bred dogs to work are just not about, i keep and work borders, and they suit me, but can be hard to ground, and take careful entering, but thats only my opinion, there is not enough written about borders.

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I'm old enough to remember good fell types, particulary those with a fair bit of Border in their make up, with ultra hard jackets and skin underneith like a fecking Rhino, don't see many like that these days :no:

 

;)

They are the sort of old :notworthy: propper borders had a very thick skin, and some were difficult to scruff, so thick was the skin!!!

But, I still hunt the hills every winter, where the border terrier was origionally bred, and with dogs that have far less protection from the weather... maybe an outcross is needed for my blood, to help restore coat.

 

Thats them D&N, ain't seen type like that for years. I'd be careful with that outcross if I were you, Borders with hard jackets & thick skin may be difficult to find but with excellent working ability, harder still...! ;)

Aye, tell us about it... like fookin rockin horse shit! But there are some good fell type strains in these parts that might suit my stuff... just a thought for now anyway. ;)

Thanks lads I appreciate your thoughts regarding correct coat :clapper: I hope you dont mind me playing devils advocate

What is wrong with the Border Terrier, what has changed so much about the Border that it is nolonger valued as a worker today? wasnt the breed standard, which also includes temperment written by men who worked there dogs and new what they wanted in a border? granted they are not as hard as alot of other terriers.

It states hunting with terriers legally..The terriers role is to locate and flush the animal not to fight with it .

 

Only soft terriers which stand back and bark are to be used.

 

All reasonable steps must be taken to prevent risk or injury to your dog.

 

So why wouldnt the Border meet this legal criteria, I am not after anyone going on the defensive just there own honest opinion and thoughts, Have the times changed in what is now required from a working terrier of today.

Cheers

Dont get me wrong there are still a few who still see the border as such... a working terrier, with no daft money value attached...

i think what happened to the border is fashion, someone sets a trend and the rest follow,so we end up with other ters, being bred by big names and the old fellas who bred dogs to work are just not about, i keep and work borders, and they suit me, but can be hard to ground, and take careful entering, but thats only my opinion, there is not enough written about borders.

Thanks Dos-N-Natives & desertdog, Anybody else got any thoughts, So Borders are slow to enter? or take longer to mature than other terriers before their ready to work? could that be part of the reason that there not favoured much.

I agree with peoples opinion, sily money, but with regards to showing and working lines im sure there are still Ped blood lines that work there dogs as well as show, one that comes to mind is Jack Price,,,Oxcroft, although even he is critical of some off the Borders you see today, eg The size of some Borders, You would have to dig them in, Never mind dig them out?? sSo anybody who have worked with Borders, once you have got them entered, what are they like as workers do they do the job?

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id only ever hand strip my borders,they keep their coat all year, when you hunt them their coat comes out, clipping makes the coat come back soft, i think all this was bought about by the show fraternity, i can remember old fellas trying to get coats right on their tykes,by breeding rough to smooth, dont know if it worked, or if their are any old uns out their that could shed some light on that, the only time i strip my terrs is when they look to untidy for my eye.

Youre right there Desert dog borders only look right when handstripped. This year at the welsh gamefair i noticed a few really pale wheaten coloured borders,i got talking to the woman who bred one of the winning borders[100% worker] and she told me their owners are lightening their colour by clipping....sad really. She also said she had been breeding borders for 10 years and had never seen a genuine wheaten border as they must have blue coloured ears if genuine. Can anyone help with me with this womans name as she had to rush off before i got her details i am sure she called her kennel Badger cregg or croft or something like that. I love seeing genuine workin borders win at these shows and im tryin to get an apprentice to my border dog hes 8 now a battle scarred old warrior one of the old types, skin so tough almost impossible to scruff with cold hands on freezin morns,hard as nails and no reverse sad to say he is a dying line can anyone with a similar bitch please p.m. me and maybe we can keep their type goin.

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id only ever hand strip my borders,they keep their coat all year, when you hunt them their coat comes out, clipping makes the coat come back soft, i think all this was bought about by the show fraternity, i can remember old fellas trying to get coats right on their tykes,by breeding rough to smooth, dont know if it worked, or if their are any old uns out their that could shed some light on that, the only time i strip my terrs is when they look to untidy for my eye.

Youre right there Desert dog borders only look right when handstripped. This year at the welsh gamefair i noticed a few really pale wheaten coloured borders,i got talking to the woman who bred one of the winning borders[100% worker] and she told me their owners are lightening their colour by clipping....sad really. She also said she had been breeding borders for 10 years and had never seen a genuine wheaten border as they must have blue coloured ears if genuine. Can anyone help with me with this womans name as she had to rush off before i got her details i am sure she called her kennel Badger cregg or croft or something like that. I love seeing genuine workin borders win at these shows and im tryin to get an apprentice to my border dog hes 8 now a battle scarred old warrior one of the old types, skin so tough almost impossible to scruff with cold hands on freezin morns,hard as nails and no reverse sad to say he is a dying line can anyone with a similar bitch please p.m. me and maybe we can keep their type goin.

Or, right Burrowman, It wasnt Bagerbeck by any chance also in my previous post another working line Oxcroft, Try also the working Border terrier section on another forum called Border terrier world, you never no you might find a bitch and put a smile on your old timers face ;)

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Thats it N.W.Mitch her kennel is badgerbeck do you know this woman,she knows her borders and works them hard. As to the oxcroft line i have a bitch decendant of oxcroft royal and oxcroft slippy on her fathers side and she has Clipstone and dandyhow blood on her mothers side,you described this bitches working style in your earlier post about the breed standard " to locate and flush the animal not fight with it" "a soft terrier to stand back and bark" this workin style may suit some people but not me, one day when i broke through as she was sounding at a fox in a stop end the fox pushed her back and she quit,she came out of the burrow and kept soundin but wouldnt go back in. If i was a single man she wouldnt have been comin home with me, but shes the wifes pet so i must tolerate her.So my mistake was going for the best of breeding on paper, when for what im after i should have looked at the face and the teeth of the dam and got a trial day out huntin if poss before partin with hard earned cash. If i was on your side of the pond i would go visit Badgerbeck kennels or try contact Andy Hurst i believe he has a good workin line also any borders with Levi Oakes breedin in them should be good.My old battler has only one G.B. Ch in his line Dazzle Em Lyndhay was his name maybe thats why he still retains the old types dense coat and rhino skin.

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