some nice pics of knives there guys , thanks for the offer masmiffy but hopefully i'l get the hang of it , when i was younger i can remember my dad using a kitchen knife that was always sharpened on the back door step , unfortunately dad died a few years back so just doing it from memory the two i cleaned turned out ok and my son actually liked hot rabbit sandwiches (its amazing what comes back to you without you realiseing it ) and im going to get a dedicated knife for the job and want to get one that is recommended by people who use them for the job thanks guys for all the advice