i have to agree with you bryan..i am honest enough to admit i love the shows and like my dogs to look good....i have been offered stupid amounts of money for my dogs just so that person can have a ready made winner..but i do also work my dogs and from my last litter i actually kept the ugliest because he showed the best attitude in the litter..he is now ten months and as keen as any ugly dog i ve ever seen..but yes he has turned out a smart dog but it was defo attitude that kept him in my yard but i whole heartedly agree with you..one of those pictures that are up is of a dog i used to own,,he